46 replies to this topic

[AcapulcoGringo]

Its Funny.. If you click on "View new posts" you see one particlular person that has went through and "quoted" everyones posts to dealth and Negativily commented as much as possible... I didnt realize this was the Baja Debate Club.. I thought it was a discussion board...

And by the way I am talking about a post in this thread, along with others....

[xolotl]

Hello, JM.

We are now officially off-topic. I apologize to everyone and offer that this spur be relocated wherever...

Neoliberales are Mexican politicians who, in the United Snakes, would be called neo-conservatives and in Spain would be known as friends of José María Aznar.

These people respect neither liberal nor conservative principles, they simply want the rich to oppress the poor.

If you're reading this, you might think you're rich but you're not. The truly wealthy don't fuss with Internet forums.

X

[jm0501]

Hello, JM.

We are now officially off-topic. I apologize to everyone and offer that this spur be relocated wherever...

Neoliberales are Mexican politicians who, in the United Snakes, would be called neo-conservatives and in Spain would be known as friends of José María Aznar.

These people respect neither liberal nor conservative principles, they simply want the rich to oppress the poor.

If you're reading this, you might think you're rich but you're not. The truly wealthy don't fuss with Internet forums.

X

Thanks, I agree
Keep up the well-informed posts

Who do you think follows like a lamb** better US or Mexican citizens?


JM

**A person easily deceived or cheated (especially in financial matters)

[Powerslave]

Um, read our federal constitution. Here in Mexico we don't want to foment the same environment that produced the revolution of 1910. Even so, what with Calderón, another revolution is fairly likely.




X

Heaven forbid that the people rise up in revolution against a corrupt government. It is much better to submit, passively. Fewer lives will be lost (in the short run, at least) that way. You must be a progressive???

[AllenSmithee]

So about that reverse inspection thing, not to break up the silly debate.

I have been sent to inspection by the Marinas on the SY crossing, about 50% of the time. It's not too big a deal, they are polite and fast, not at all like the one time I got sent to secondary going north. The US agents were unprofessional and had a personal conversation for 15 minutes while I was waiting to be inspected.

The only inconvenience is when they narrow the incoming traffic to one lane and it gets balled up for about a mile.

[BajaGringo]

As I travel up and down Baja from the border area to San Quintin and at times to El Rosario and parts further south, I pass through multiple check points along the way. Military, PEP, Federales and others. Without exception they have al been professional and polite. Wish they could teach that to the border agents going north bound...

[otayBill]

Its has taken longer than usual to enter Mexico this week. Just read in today's the Union-Tribune that Mexican officials are checking people entering the country more carefully. Looking for symtoms of the flu.

[xolotl]

I have to figure out how to mark these posts as "este arroz ya está cocido". I was suckered into answering Rich's ethnocentrism a second time. Let's move beyond that and address the additional issues.

If it will help your peace of mind, most "innocent civilians" who are attacked in Tijuana are attacked with armas blancas -- knives and whatnot. Guns tend to be the purview of the drug cartels -- the Arrellano-Félix cartel brings their guns in from Logan Heights (San Diego) and the Cartel del Golfo gets their weapons from the Mexican army, courtesy of Tío Felipe, and those tend to be either from the U.S. or else illegal knock-offs of a German submachine gun.

As it happens, most of the arms that were deployed in the Decena Trágica also came from the U.S. For armaments intended for the Magonistas and Villistas, the U.S. federal government attempted interdiction and imprisonment; for armaments intended for the Porfiristas and Maderistas, the U.S. federal government was complicit both in financing and logistics. Don't take my word for it: history books in Mexico are cheap and readily available.

You might not think you're bashing Mexico with such an opinion as Rich has voiced but I would warn you (if you do live here among us) that your neighbors are likely to take offense at such a attitude.

If you are offended by what I just said, bear in mind that I am being quite mild: I have neighbors who would rather kill you. The U.S. is, after all, the most universally hated country in history. If you really want to tell the cow how she ate the cabbage, you first need to own the cow.

Who do you think follows like a lamb** better US or Mexican citizens?
**A person easily deceived or cheated (especially in financial matters)

The facile answer is that no Mexican bought into the Donald Trump scandal. But you deserve a serious answer.

Mexicans generally know when they're being ripped off but they endure it because of five thousand years of caciqismo. Octavio Paz discusses this in The Labyrinth of Solitude. Powerslave probably thought he was being clever when he pointed this out but he only demonstrated that he does not understand Mexico at all. Seriously, un macho sabe aguantarse.

Gringos are much more easily deceived but they also squeal like stuck pigs when they suspect they've been had.

So about that reverse inspection thing

You all understand that every sovereign country has the obligation to inspect those who would pass through its borders, right? So what do you all mean by "reverse" inspection?

Now I will speak from personal experience of the San Ysidro border crossing that dates back to the early 1970s. Mexico has always been more expedient than the United Snakes. That does not mean that Mexico has abrogated its obligation to inspect, only that it has chosen to inspect in a less oppressive manner. Mexico has been applying the ISO9000 quality system by checking every tenth person at random.

The problem here is that ISO9000 does not function in a corrupt system. I know this because I tried to administer ISO9000 quality systems in two corrupt companies in the United Snakes. Mexico also knows this because she takes her Customs agents from the army and the army is working for the Cartel del Golfo. So the Arrellano-Félix Cartel (CAF) has a one-in-ten chance of getting caught when they bring stuff into Mexico and the the Cartel del Golfo has a zero-in-ten chance of getting caught. And even the one-in-ten chance of the CAF is attenuated by the effect of individual bribery because Tijuana is the CAF's home turf.

So how should Mexico prevent another disaster like the one at Cibola del Mar some thirteen years back? (The CAF sent a hit squad from Logan Heights to wipe out the extended family of one of their mid-level dealers who lived at the entrance to Ensenada.) At this point, ISO9000 says we need to fall back on thorough inspections. I'd love to have been in that meeting -- Mexican politicians looking at one another and saying, "But then we'll be as bad as the effing gringos!" Now we are looking at a choice between a seven-second weigh-and-release system or a real-time vertical X-ray system. Both will likely slow down southbound traffic somewhat, although not nearly as much as the ICE delays northbound traffic.

Funny thing is that I have a friend in Colonia Cacho who insists they've been doing weigh-and-release for the last fifteen years or more. I've always thought this guy was a bit too paranoid ... but in truth my car generally wound up getting the red light whenever it was a little too heavy.

X

[Scooby]

Hello, JM.

We are now officially off-topic. I apologize to everyone and offer that this spur be relocated wherever...

Neoliberales are Mexican politicians who, in the United Snakes, would be called neo-conservatives and in Spain would be known as friends of José María Aznar.

These people respect neither liberal nor conservative principles, they simply want the rich to oppress the poor.

If you're reading this, you might think you're rich but you're not. The truly wealthy don't fuss with Internet forums.

X

Like JM, I say thanks for the well informed posts.

But as far this "reverse" stuff, I was p*ssed off that all the tasty flavored ice cream I was hauling back to TJ was melted during the wait to get back in.
Interesting those petty things which will get some of us snarling for revolution.

[xolotl]

as far this "reverse" stuff, I was p*ssed off that all the tasty flavored ice cream I was hauling back to TJ was melted during the wait to get back in.

Yes, I can appreciate that. If you want really good ice cream, you need to go to Spain or France. Lactose intolerance is too high in Mexico to support such a product. But, oh!, the ice creams in Europe! When I was a kid, I was convinced there were two forms of vanilla ice cream in Spain, the helado de crema that I knew in the U.S. and the helado de vainilla, which is something utterly transcendental. It took me many years to realize that helado de crema was simply frozen cream with no flavoring whatsoever.

But, as to what we're now calling the "reverse stuff", as if the gringos were more justified than the Mexicans to slow down traffic at the border, please understand we have this little problem. During our current Prohibition, the drugs have been flowing north and the guns and money have been flowing south. But who is it who crosses the border on a daily basis? Something like eighty percent of all traffic comes from Tijuana, either to work in San Diego or to shop San Ysidro.

I wonder how many borders you all have crossed. They are all different. Some are forbidding, some are welcoming. Compare northbound and southbound in San Ysidro, for an example. My personal favorite was Shannon Airport in Ireland, where I showed up with a head full of LSD and baggage full of recreational drugs and all the Customs agent said to me was "Do have a nice visit, sir." My worst was probably Miami, where a Customs agent came up behind me to address me in bad Spanish. I had just flown in from Suriname, one of the few countries in this hemisphere that does not speak Spanish, so he caught me completely off-guard. I tend to answer in the language I'm addressed in so I spent about fifteen minutes trying to convince this guy that I'm not Cuban. Even so they went through my bags very carefully to make sure I didn't have any illegal cigars or bombs or DNA from Che Guevara.

As to the ice cream, here in Mexico it's called nieve not only because much of the population is lactose-intolerant (and, yes, there were no cows here before the Spaniards showed up) but also because the ruling class in Tenochtitlán ordinarily finished their meals with snow brought down from Popocatéptl or Ixtaccíhuatl by fast runners and flavored with fruit purées.

Interesting those petty things which will get some of us snarling for revolution.

Here in Mexico, revolution is not triggered by anything petty. What caused the Boston Tea Party? Seriously, I think the reason why firearms are illegal in Mexico is because armed rebellion is so distasteful. We are meant to put up with almost anything. Not accept, just endure.

That's the Mexican way -- to accept things up to a point but after that then all hell breaks loose. It behooves us all to make sure that all hell does not break loose once again.

I appreciate your kind words. In fact, all of us in Mexico appreciate your kind words.

X

[Ryu]

Some great post xolotl, thanks.

[bajashrink]

Yes, I can appreciate that. If you want really good ice cream, you need to go to Spain or France. Lactose intolerance is too high in Mexico to support such a product. But, oh!, the ice creams in Europe! When I was a kid, I was convinced there were two forms of vanilla ice cream in Spain, the helado de crema that I knew in the U.S. and the helado de vainilla, which is something utterly transcendental. It took me many years to realize that helado de crema was simply frozen cream with no flavoring whatsoever.

But, as to what we're now calling the "reverse stuff", as if the gringos were more justified than the Mexicans to slow down traffic at the border, please understand we have this little problem. During our current Prohibition, the drugs have been flowing north and the guns and money have been flowing south. But who is it who crosses the border on a daily basis? Something like eighty percent of all traffic comes from Tijuana, either to work in San Diego or to shop San Ysidro.

I wonder how many borders you all have crossed. They are all different. Some are forbidding, some are welcoming. Compare northbound and southbound in San Ysidro, for an example. My personal favorite was Shannon Airport in Ireland, where I showed up with a head full of LSD and baggage full of recreational drugs and all the Customs agent said to me was "Do have a nice visit, sir." My worst was probably Miami, where a Customs agent came up behind me to address me in bad Spanish. I had just flown in from Suriname, one of the few countries in this hemisphere that does not speak Spanish, so he caught me completely off-guard. I tend to answer in the language I'm addressed in so I spent about fifteen minutes trying to convince this guy that I'm not Cuban. Even so they went through my bags very carefully to make sure I didn't have any illegal cigars or bombs or DNA from Che Guevara.

As to the ice cream, here in Mexico it's called nieve not only because much of the population is lactose-intolerant (and, yes, there were no cows here before the Spaniards showed up) but also because the ruling class in Tenochtitlán ordinarily finished their meals with snow brought down from Popocatéptl or Ixtaccíhuatl by fast runners and flavored with fruit purées.


Here in Mexico, revolution is not triggered by anything petty. What caused the Boston Tea Party? Seriously, I think the reason why firearms are illegal in Mexico is because armed rebellion is so distasteful. We are meant to put up with almost anything. Not accept, just endure.

That's the Mexican way -- to accept things up to a point but after that then all hell breaks loose. It behooves us all to make sure that all hell does not break loose once again.

I appreciate your kind words. In fact, all of us in Mexico appreciate your kind words.

X

Don't forget Italian gellato. 30% butterfat. There's a gellato ice cream shop on Blvd. Agua Caliente across from the twin towers in the complex where Carl's Jr. and Blockbuster are located. Mex locals eat it anyway in spite of being prone to obesity and low tolerance to lactose as a result of our Amerindian genes.

U.S. customs and port of entry inspectors have the reputation of being the world's rudest.

In spite of misleading signs on U.S. freeways as you approach the border xings and ignorance on the part of the foreign media, firearms and ammo are not illegal in Mexico--only private gun shops are. Adult Mexican citizens can purchase about a dozen different makes and models of rifles, shotguns, and handguns and the ammo that goes with them at certain military bases and keep them in their homes and businesses. Upon acquisition, you even get a 60-day permit to transport it unloaded in your vehicle, and their are permits to transport it for hunting in legally-designated hunting regions during hunting season. Gun registration permits are expensive, though, depending on the type of firearm. CCW permits are difficult to get.

Foreigners can also get hunting permits and permits to transport their hunting rifles and shotguns and ammo into Mexico at Mexican consulates. Again, there are certain regions and seasons in Mexico where hunting with approved firearms is permited.

[BajaGringo]

I have met several gringos who hunt in the hills east and southeast of San Quintin. They told me it wasn't that difficult...

[zunigan]

I now only cross in and out of Otay twice a month and I its almost as bad going in as out. I waited last Friday for 45 minutes. Border patrol, Highway patrol on our side and the army and whoever else on that side. I love going down there but this is just becoming to much.

[eclipse]

I now only cross in and out of Otay twice a month and I its almost as bad going in as out. I waited last Friday for 45 minutes. Border patrol, Highway patrol on our side and the army and whoever else on that side. I love going down there but this is just becoming to much.

The Otay wait seems mostly due to the CHP and BP narrowing all traffic to one lane. Once you get through their bottle neck, it's not much of a problem. You can really shorten your wait by going to the far left lane and not merging in until you absolutely have to. It's a legitimate lane (not riding a shoulder or anything), but for some reason a lot of people don't take it. You can zip past a lot of people over there.

[George Costanza]

They do this everyday in Otay now. Have you seen the new maze they constructed when you leave Mexico through Otay?
It's barely enough to get your car through let alone a large truck. I've personally scene two trucks scrape the barriers. It's only a matter of time before people start to complain and they remove all the concrete barriers. In the AM the border can be at a standstill because of the backup from the barriors.

[eclipse]

They do this everyday in Otay now. Have you seen the new maze they constructed when you leave Mexico through Otay?
It's barely enough to get your car through let alone a large truck. I've personally scene two trucks scrape the barriers. It's only a matter of time before people start to complain and they remove all the concrete barriers. In the AM the border can be at a standstill because of the backup from the barriors.

Yeah, the barriers on the way out really suck. Did they have a rash of runners or something? I drive a van (a minivan, but it's still bigger than a standard car) and I'm always afraid I'm going to scrape it. It's a huge PITA. Sometimes when it's really backed up, they send the Sentri lane cars out behind secondary on a straight shot out - I wish they'd do that all the time.

[bajashrink]

I remember once at San Ysidro they had to pull those barriers out further so a limo could pass through.

[Buen Amigo]

O yeah those barriers can be a PITA. But like someone said before, in the sentri lane sometimes they send you the back way, thats cool.

A limo? I wounder how many pollos were in that car....lol....

[GaryN]

Have you guys noticed they are doing their best to keep people out of Mexico? My friends won't even visit now.
I saw those barriers a few weeks ago and the lines were all jacked up because of them!
Took us 90 mins to cross and we had to wait at the booth for another 5 mins as their was no room for the cars to get through.
Then coming back it was another 20 mins I got caught when they were doing random inspections. i was told they are doing these everyday now.